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Don't.
Use.
.
Just.
Don't.

“Free users for sure we don’t want to give that [end-to-end encryption] because we also want to work together with FBI, with local law enforcement in case some people use Zoom for a bad purpose” - Eric Yuan, CEO.
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bloomberg.com/news/articles/20

@elpanzer Ça me paraît quand même compliqué avec les alternatives pour le moment... Jitsi à trop ça fonctionne pas, BBB y a peu d'instances.
T'as une solution à proposer pour les non initiés?

@Faket Je n'utilise que au-delà de deux pax - Signal sinon mais je vais retenter Conversations (XMPP) qui propose la phonie depuis peu.

Pléthore d'instances disponibles ici:

github.com/jitsi/jitsi-meet/wi

@elpanzer Mais pour faire des cours / réunions à genre 10, Jitsi c'est vraiment problématique apparemment.

@Faket Scaleway par exemple a musclé son offre apparemment avec ensemble.scaleway.com/ donc à réessayer ?

@elpanzer Merci de l'info, je la partage aux personnes qui pourraient en avoir besoin.

@elpanzer Does that mean that people who pay use zoom for a good purpose?

@tania Surely...

Depends from which / whose perspective.

;)

@elpanzer Instead, use Jitsi! Open source/free software, better UI, and end-to-end encryption. Join the call with voice, video, or screenshare in Firefox or Chrome, no downloads needed. https://meet.jit.si/

@cadence @elpanzer important to note that jitsi is NOT end to end encrypted for group calls yet, and should not be treated as such until their e2ee implementation has had some time to settle.

@jay @cadence Yep true, thanks for pointing it out. I read somewhere they're on it though.

@elpanzer @cadence yeah they're making great progress iirc! it's just not quite ready yet so folks should be careful

@moritzheiber

Wow. Keep your cool mate, I thought I was on Twitter for a second... Shall we talk about Zoom's servers located 'by mistake' in Mainland China? That ain't FUD.

"Zoom admits some calls were routed through China by mistake" - techcrunch.com/2020/04/03/zoom

@schnittchen

@elpanzer @schnittchen So? I have 1600+ colleagues working for our clients, in- & outside of China. Should I no longer have conference calls with them, in acceptable quality & with reasonable latency?

Additionally, Zoom has since added features to both, their backend & frontend, to clear differentiate between calls involving relay servers located in China or elsewhere ..

They have acknowledged their mistakes, they've stood up a reasonable roadmap, yet people continue to vilify them.

@elpanzer @schnittchen If you want a more reasoned approach to this, here it is: orangecyberdefense.com/global/

Literally everyone is doing the same thing as Zoom does (with a few notable exceptions that have been publicly acknowledged and Zoom even bought a whole company for (!) to resolve them), some of the players are even worse, and Zoom is a reasonable choice given the parameters some folks have ..

Is it the best choice for everyone? No. But what product is?

@elpanzer @schnittchen Given its exposure and widespread adoption in a matter of seconds (speaking from a tech perspective) it's not just a reasonable choice, it's also a product people like to use.

If any of the other options (and that includes open source solutions) were offering up the same level of quality it wouldn't have played out the way it did ..

@elpanzer @schnittchen
Can this change? Of course! Personally, I'm super excited for products like Jitsi or BigBlueButton to gain more traction and become more viable for a broader audience ..

Sometimes folks have different priorities. And sometimes those are simply "I need to be able to talk to my grandparents, easily, with a good quality and an interface they understand" and not care about stuff like E2EE or whether or not somebody in China is potentially listening in on your calls ..

@elpanzer @schnittchen (and I'm sorry for potentially having offended you with my initial reaction, but the deafening, reactionary postings each and every time somebody brings up Zoom, spreading incorrect or incoherent information, have chipped away at my patience over time ..

My apologies)

We're cool @moritzheiber, no worries.

You might be familiar about Mainland China and their offensive capabilities in tech. I'm just standing by my statement that a company having assets based in Mainland CN can't be trusted with my data. It's mandatory - by law - to give data access to CN authorities.

Hence E2EE is also mandatory if you don't want to be ripped off.

@schnittchen

@moritzheiber he does have his facts straight. Did you read the thread you linked?

twitter.com/alexstamos/status/ in particular, but Stamos also talks about the law enforcement angle

@elpanzer @schnittchen

@moritzheiber @elpanzer

You're linking to Mr "responsible E2E encryption" 😮

As the former Facebook CISO, it's not surprising he uses weasel words like that and one can also see it throughout the :birdsite: thread.
It's like saying "a backdoor, but only for the 'good' guys".
There is no such thing.

@elpanzer Wow.... Yeah, fuck zoom.

Looks like I need to take w/ some care professionals about using another interface. Fuck.

@elpanzer @sir It’s interesting to compare this to twitter.com/alexstamos/status/.

There’s a bunch of “one hand doesn’t talk to the other and then they both throw the third hand under the bus” Ive seen happening inside Zoom as well. Feels like this is more of that.

@matro

You're probably right. Despite the deepest respect I could have for Alex Stamos, his capacity to leave at the right time (read: after disaster strikes) and to make it out unscathed is amazing.

Can't help myself thinking all this is just a PR stunt. But I'm probably wrong.

@sir

@jeff "Embrace, extend & extinguish"?

I deleted my Keybase account the day Zoom took them over. (Fortunately) I never had my private key uploaded on Keybase - as some did or had KB running locally.

Keybase could have communicated they were about to be sold off. Nope, they caught everyone hands down.

(All this was probably in the ToS).

@elpanzer
So, basically, if you pay you're okay; if you don't, you're classified as a possible criminal. That's not cool.

@Horizon_Innovations Yep, that's pretty much what Zoom's CEO says: "(if you don't pay) you can run but you can't hide".

@elpanzer more of the insinuation that if you don't pay (not want or can't, financial or principle) then you you are highly likely to be a criminal and open to the investigations of the authorities. It's a broad brush slap in the face!

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